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Ruth Hoffman

IMO, the more you "do" should read: the "more code you contribute". There doesn't seem to be any way for an individual interested in other aspects of OFBiz to participate at the "leadership" level.

  1. Hi Ruth,

    It's true that it's more related to code, but you may also help

    • by reviewing patches in Jira issues,
    • help in documentation here or in the embedded documentation,
    • help on dev ML when there are discussions on new features, licence subject, ...
    • help others on user ML,
    • ...

    So it's all about contributing, and I know you do already some of these.

    1. Hi Jacques:
      By leadership, I mean someone who can make the type of decisions being made by the PMC committee. For example, how can I get someone to make a decision to allow me access to the OFBiz web site ( I notice that many of the PMC members place all kinds of information about themselves and/or their affiliations on that landing page. I'm talking specifically about the "In The News" section.

      Dare I ask: can a non-committer be a PMC member? Aside from the ASF members, I don't see a single PMC member who is not a committer. How would a non-committer gain PMC membership?

      1. Hi Ruth,
        I can't answer for the community here, and the better is to refer to Apache Meritocracy and eventually other opinions on Apache Meritocracy by Googling for them...

        BTW, doing that I found an example based on OFBiz experience, and yes it seems that it all comes down to code: "they granted direct access to the code repository" in Apache Meritocracy section.

        For the "In The News" section. I don't think it's specifically related to PMC members, for instance there have never been information about me on this page, nor about most PMC people. It's true that there are some "Sponsorship links" on this page and some links which look a bit commercial, notably recently in the news section. On the other hand, these links provide helpful tutorials and if you like to have some links there you could ask for it and I can't see any reasons it would be refused.

        The sponsorship links should dissapear when all our ressources will be handled on ASF infrastructure. BTW another mean to help here... So far we are only and handful of people dealing with that.

        Note on the sponsorship links: I think that "Site Design and Matching Theme Provided by" will remain as long as anybody see a problem with that. And if someone see a problem then it should be better discussed on user ML, where eveybody has a voice.

        My 2 cts

      2. The PMC members try to keep an eye on what happens in the project and identify people who have contributed a lot.

        There is always a possibility that people who have contributed a lot, in any form of contribution, haven't been noticed by a PMC member. If that is the case, and someone else notices then please notify the PMC on the private mailing list (

        We definitely have a goal to make sure the PMC includes everyone who is significantly involved in making the project what it is (and of course who is willing to serve on the PMC).

    2. I guess that last sentence (in Jacques first reaction to Ruth's posting) should be: so it's all about contributing.

      1. Actually I meant, "So it's not all about contributing patches in Jira, and I know you do already some of these (Ruth's books, etc.)"

How can it be that the PMC is not in control of the lists of PMC and committers outside these project pages?

When you (as the PMC) say that a committer has gone emeritus, by own resignation or by decision of the PMC then the result should be visible in all the lists, everywhere.

Showing a message at the top of this page, stating that there is a 'more official' list might lead to the perception that you're not in control or even worse.

Nobody never said that the

PMC is not in control of the lists of PMC and committers outside these project pages

And yes these outside lists should always be up to date. But weirdly, as far as I know, a committer can't resign as a PMC member can. So once committer means committer for life. I personaly find this a bit weird since a committer can completly forget the project but still her/his credential has access. We know what this can mean in term of security! Of course the other commiters are there and watch, so nothing really bad should never happen, but still would be simpler if committers accounts could be revocated!

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